Bibble - Inerrant, dammit!
18 October 2005 by Rockstar RyanAt least according to Xian blogger David Heddle . Says Heddle:
I find it very interesting, this insistence of atheist evolutionists that an inerrant bible is incompatible with science.
He follows up with a great quote from science blogger PZ Myers:
A religion that declares the bible inerrant is not compatible with science, because its followers would have to be idiots.
Apparently David and his Christer buddies have a problem with this. But in true apologist form, they do not take on Professor Myers’ statement. No, they simply whine about “atheist bigots” calling them idiots. David, following the Xian apologist textbook, takes this opportunity to express the controversy!
…see religion has nothing to fear from science—these scientists and devout Christians see no conflict whatsoever.
However, it is a strategy they just can’t make themselves follow. Why? I can only assume that it is because their hatred for Christianity far outweighs the possible political advantage. Someone like Myers could never say: “What are you worried about? Professor X believes in the compatibility of an inerrant bible and science. Science is not your enemy.” No, to someone like Myers religion must be the enemy. It just has to be. No alliances permitted. He loves being an enemy of religion.
So, according to Heddle, the only reason we atheists feel the bibble contradicts science is because of our hatred for Christianity.
Stop right there David! I’m not a fan of apologetics. I like evidence and science. Here’s just a few examples where the bibble and fact collide like a fat kid and a cupcake:
1. Which genealogy of Jebus should we believe - Mark or Luke?
2. What were the true last words of Jebus?
3. Since when do animals in the family leporidae chew their cud? (Lev. 11:5-6)
4. Pi must be 3, according to the good book. (I Kings 7:23)
*Update 10/19/05
Found an interesting argument against point 4 here. Apologetics or not?
Need I produce more? That’s why we feel any religion that calls the bibble “inerrant” would require idiots to follow it.
18 October 2005, on 4:17 pm
#1.
Jesus was born of the virgin Mary by the Holy Ghost. Therefore, in the announcement of the angel to Mary about the birth (Luke 1:31-35), Jesus is called “the Son of the Highest” and “the Son of God”. Even at age 12 when He spoke with the doctors in the temple, Jesus knew that God was His “Father” (Luke 2:49). In explanation of His special relationship to God as Father, Jesus testified, “I proceeded forth and came from God” (John 8:42). First and foremost, this is the genealogy ofJesus.
Matthew 1:1-17 and Luke 3:23-38 give the genealogy of Jesus.
Matthew recorded Joseph’s lineage,
while Luke gave the family tree of Mary.
It is written out in more detail and with great study in this short essay.
http://www.learnthebible.org/q_a_genealogy_of_jesus.htm
#2 last words of Jesus for the cross
The First Word
“Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing. ” Luke 23:34
Words of forgiveness
The Second Word
“Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in Paradise.” Luke 23: 43
Words of forgiveness and grace to ones with only the faith the size of a mustard seed
The Third Word
“Woman, here is your son.” John 19: 26
The basic meaning of Jesus’ statement is clear. He was entrusting care of his mother to one of his most intimate friends and followers. He was making sure that she would be loved and cared for after Jesus’ death.
Notice Jesus’ attention to the needs of others, in this case his mother, even in his hour of excruciating suffering. This is a fine observation and surely fits with everything else we know about Jesus.
The Fourth Word
“My God, my God, why have you forsaken me? ” Mark 15:34
is a direct quotation from Psalm 22:1. Jesus, in his moment of greatest anguish, prayed in words that had been etched upon his soul through years of synagogue worship and personal reflection.
Yet, in this context, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” takes on startling new dimensions. Jesus isn’t simply a man crying out to God as he is being abused by others, he is also the divine Son of God crying out to God the Father. Through the fourth word from the cross we enter into the essence of Christ’s sacrifice. God is forsaking his Son in that he is allowing Jesus to bear the sin of the world. He’s regarding his Son as if he were sin itself. In the words of the Apostle Paul, “For our sake [God] made [Jesus] to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21).
The Fifth Word
“I am thirsty.” John 19:28
The thirst of Jesus reminds us that he was really experiencing the horrors of the cross, including extreme thirst. Moreover, it reminds us that Jesus was fully human, the sort of being who could be thirsty. This fact isn’t incidental, but absolutely essential to the saving work of Christ.
The Sixth Word
It is finished.” John 19:30
What is finished? On a most obvious level, Jesus’ passion is over. He has suffered extreme physical horrors, not to mention the unimaginable horror of bearing human sin. Now, on the verge of death, Jesus’ suffering is finished.
But there are other levels of meaning in the phrase “It is finished” besides the most obvious one. Throughout the Gospel of John Jesus mentions his calling to finish or complete the works his Father has given him:
“My food is to do the will of him who sent me and to complete his work.” (4:34)
“But I have a testimony greater than John’s. The works that the Father has given me to complete, the very works that I am doing, testify on my behalf that the Father has sent me.” (5:36)
What are the works Jesus was sent to complete? As the Word of God Incarnate, he was the unique revealer, the one who perfectly revealed the glory of the Father (1:14, 18). He taught the truth of God and, indeed, embodied that truth (1:14; 8:31-32; 14:6). He did works of power, signs that revealed his glory and led people to believe his teaching (John 2:11). He loved his followers and gave them the commandment to love each other (13:34-35; 15:12-13) His greatest work of all was being crucified for the sake of the world, that which Jesus described as “being lifted up.” For example, consider these verses from John 3:
“And just as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, that whoever believes in him may have eternal life. For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal life. Indeed, God did not send the Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him” (3:14-17)
The Seventh Word
“Father, into your hands I commend my spirit.” Luke 23:46
Jesus is quoting from Psalm 31, Jesus is not only entrusting his spirit to God, but also affirming his ultimate trust in God, even the God who has laid upon him the sin of the world. Moreover, the fact that Jesus continues to address God as “Father” indicates his unwavering confidence in the One he has known so intimately and served so faithfully.
Throughout our lives we rely on all sorts of things. We begin life fully dependent on our parents. Along the way we trust teachers, doctors, lawyers, pilots, engineers, spouses, presidents, police officers, friends, pastors, and, of course, ourselves. But, in the end, we put our ultimate trust in God, and in God alone. We realize we can’t save ourselves. We can’t make eternal life happen. We can’t defeat death. We can’t earn our redemption. So, like David in Psalm 31, and like Jesus in Luke 23, we put our lives into the hands of God.
Yet we do so with a peculiar confidence. We know that, in the mystery of the Trinity, God’s hands are not only strong, but vulnerable. They’re not only healing, but wounded. The hands of Jesus, pierced on the cross, are the very hands of God. Into these hands we can trust ourselves completely, knowing that they’ll always be there to catch us, both in life and in death.
To read more…Music for Holy Week
http://www.markdroberts.com/htmfiles/resources/sevenlastwords.htm
#3
Lev 11, all of this chapter is about what aminals are to be considered clean and unclean. This is Old Testament stuff about what God wanted his people to stay away from to keep His people healthy and make them stand apart from others.
If you have ever trapped a wild rabbit as a kid (I have) they are so covered in fleas that you would never want to touch one again.
The last Question #4, I am not going to address because I not sure what is being asked.
Thanks for these questions, it was a great study for me.
18 October 2005, on 4:57 pm
First and foremost, this is the genealogy ofJesus
Then why were genealogies included if they were wrong/useless??
Matthew 1:1-17 and Luke 3:23-38 give the genealogy of Jesus.
Matthew recorded Joseph’s lineage,
while Luke gave the family tree of Mary.
I couldn’t find any evidence of this. Also, why do they both end w/ Joseph?? Why is one lineage only 28 generations and the other 43?? You mean to tell me that one was 300 years older than the other? C’mon, that is dishonest. Or does a Xian get to pick and choose what to believe literally?
The Sixth Word
It is finished.” John 19:30
Again, dishonesty. You did not include the whole verse. It is “When Jesus therefore had received the vinegar, he said, It is finished: and he bowed his head, and gave up the ghost.” He died then. There were no more words out of Jebus’ mouth.
“Father, into your hands I commend my spirit.”
Need I point out dishonesty again? How about the whole verse - “And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.” There were no more words out of his mouth.
Thus proves the rampant contradiction. Is one allowed to cut and paste the bibble?
If you have ever trapped a wild rabbit as a kid (I have) they are so covered in fleas that you would never want to touch one again.
Avoiding the question. Why does the bibble say that rabbits and the like chew their cud? The point of my article was to point out that fact and the bibble collide. Well? Should not Gawd know that bunnies chew cud not?
For an explanation of point 4, this is how pi is determined. Circumference divided by diameter. According to I Kings 7:23, And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.
30 divided by 10 is 3. Pi is equal to approximately 3.14159. Before you point out this is only a minor difference, ask an engineer how significant it truly is.
18 October 2005, on 4:59 pm
Sable:
If I sound curt, apologies. When dealing with logic I’m VERY matter-of-fact. It does not represent my personality in the least:)
18 October 2005, on 8:17 pm
Here’s a fun one about Jebus’ genealogy: Jebus was from the line of David because Joseph was from the line of David, right? And we know that the Messiah was to come from the line of David and here’s yet another piece of AMAZING evidence that Jebus was the Messiah.
Um. Jebus was immaculately conceived. What the fuck difference does it make what line Joseph came from?
Doh!
18 October 2005, on 9:47 pm
Sorry. The proper spelling is genealogy. Don’t want Dena to come on here and make fun of me for getting that wrong. Hi, Dena! We know you’ll be back soon, ya know!
19 October 2005, on 7:47 am
PS: I like evidence and science. Here’s just a few examples where the bibble and fact collide like a fat kid and a cupcake:
I was a fat kid and this still made me laugh.
19 October 2005, on 4:19 pm
Just found an interesting response to the pi question. Basically it has to do with rounding, interpreting Hebrew, and assuming what the structure referred to in I Kings 7:23 looked like. Interesting, but apologetics? Please discuss. (I say yes)
5 October 2006, on 12:40 am
Jessica M….
I’m sorry for little off-topic, but I want to ask you about design of this site. Did you make this template yourself or got from any templates website? Looks pretty cool for me :)…