The End of World as We Know It?
27 July 2006 by Sean
(Thanks to Mark for this one.)
Holy War:
A Texas Preacher
Leads Campaign
To Let Israel Fight
Mr. Hagee Draws Evangelicals
By Arguing Jewish State
Fulfills Biblical Prophecy
By ANDREW HIGGINS
July 27, 2006WASHINGTON — After Israel sent warplanes into Iraq in 1981 to bomb a nuclear reactor, Texas televangelist John Hagee sent letters to 150 fellow Christian preachers to rally support for the Jewish state.
He got just one positive response. When Mr. Hagee pressed ahead with plans for a pro-Israel gathering in a San Antonio theater, he says he got a death threat on the phone and someone shot out all the windows of his station wagon parked in his driveway.
Last week, as Israel’s armed forces pounded Lebanon and worries of a wider conflagration mounted, Mr. Hagee presided over what he called a “miracle of God”: a gathering of 3,500 evangelical Christians packed into a Washington hotel to cheer Israel and its current military campaign.
Standing on a stage bedecked with a huge Israeli flag, Mr. Hagee drew rapturous applause and shouts of “amen” as he hailed Israel for doing God’s work in a “war of good versus evil.” Calls for Israel to show restraint violate “God’s foreign-policy statement” toward Jews, he said, citing a verse from the Old Testament that promises to “bless those who bless you” and curse “the one who curses you.”
The gathering was sponsored by Christians United for Israel, a national organization the 66-year-old preacher set up this year. The group lobbies politicians in Washington, rallies grassroots support for Israel and aims to educate Christians on what it calls the “biblical imperative” of supporting the Jewish state.
Mr. Hagee is a leading figure in the so-called Christian-Zionist movement. This evangelical political philosophy is rooted in biblical prophecies and a belief that Israel’s struggles signal a prelude to Armageddon. Its followers staunchly support the Bush administration’s unequivocal backing of Israel in its current battle with Hezbollah in Lebanon.
President Bush sent a message to the gathering praising Mr. Hagee and his supporters for “spreading the hope of God’s love and the universal gift of freedom.” The Israeli prime minister also sent words of thanks. Israel’s ambassador, its former military chief and a host of U.S. political heavyweights, mostly Republican, attended.
Hey, here’s a thought: maybe John Hagee is the Anti-Christ?
27 July 2006, on 7:28 pm
If he and the other end-of-the-worlders are right and the world does end because of the mid east crisis, I put dibs all his stuff.
27 July 2006, on 7:32 pm
Sean,
That’s a damn good possiblity.
OK, I have a confession. I watch this guy. I watch him because he is scary funny. I csn be outraged and amused all at once!
And that he’s also on a network that reaches 30 to 50 million Americans. He’s my meatball of the flying spaghetti monster.
He’s on TBN. He’s a regular, and does a talk show bit during the week on occasion as well.
Now, TBN is on to “All Apocalypse, WOW!” programming. If the preacher ain’t talking about the jeebus zombie act, they’re insturcting them to vote their faith. And Hagee is right in the middle of the pile of shit.
27 July 2006, on 8:19 pm
He said “Gawd’s foreign policy statement” towards Jews. So, that must mean Gawd is American, Gawd is a Government, or Gawd is the American Government. ~~~ I’d like to take a 1960 Lincoln with suicide doors and grind that fat fuck Hagee’s face off on the asphalt whirring by at about 90mph. ~~~ These people are shithouse rats, off the fumes, and onto the solid stuff. They’ve gone rogue, relinquished all ties to sanity, and sailed far beyond “redemption”- as it’s meant logically, rationally, and decidedly not biblically. ~~~ Is there any reason outside of, you know, the law, that these FUCKTARDS shouldn’t have their plugs pulled? ~~~ Wouldn’t that be a favor to them in their worldview? Aren’t they really just dying to meet their maker.
Fundie’s life is flashing before him. Just a G-rated slideshow without sound or words. Just as he’s taking his final breath, there comes a picture of his mom and dad holding the infant fundie.
The final picture is captioned:
“These are your Makers, you demented fuckwit!”
27 July 2006, on 8:27 pm
The other two most sad things about him are:
1. His stuff consists of velvet Jesus paintings, a complete, autographed set of the Left Behind series, and….not much else.
2. The sicker part that might interest BigDumbChimp is this:
http://www.rickross.com/reference/tv_preachers/tv_preachers7.html
“As the nonprofit organization’s president, Hagee drew $540,000 in compensation, as well as an additional $302,005 in compensation for his position as president of Cornerstone Church, according to GETV’s tax statements.
He also received $411,561 in benefits from GETV, including contributions to a retirement package for highly paid executives the IRS calls a “rabbi trust,” so named because the first beneficiary of such an irrevocable trust was a rabbi.
The John Hagee Rabbi Trust includes a $2.1 million 7,969-acre ranch outside Brackettville, with five lodges, including a “main lodge” and a gun locker. It also includes a manager’s house, a smokehouse, a skeet range and three barns.
Taken together, his payment package, $842,005 in compensation and $414,485 in benefits, was one of the highest, if not the highest, pay package for a nonprofit director in the San Antonio area in 2001.”
Yet another reason that the whole notion of tax-free U.S. “charities” needs to be seriously revamped.
I wonder how much American military-related stock he owns.
Sorry for pissing everyone off, guys.
27 July 2006, on 9:11 pm
In other words, Hagee is not a True Xian (TM).
Next…
Oops, what happened there? Oh well, I got nothing else.
27 July 2006, on 10:08 pm
RDZ
Don’t you dare get a drop o Hagee spooge on that Lincoln or I’ll have to go primitive on your ass. You bess use a long rope. Kinda like water skiing. Bounce,oomph bounc bounce oonmphargh.
28 July 2006, on 12:02 am
Mr. Magee is supporting the right side for irrational and bizarre reasons.
The Party of God (the Hezb’Allah) is the A-Team of terrorism and needs to be eradicated. These bastards killed 241 American peacekeepers in 1983. They didn’t do it because they’re oppressed proletarians, they did it because they’re religious fanatics who want to export Iran’s Islamic Revolution. (Religious fanatics in the Party of God? Who would have guessed?)
28 July 2006, on 12:39 am
Mr. Bowden, if they’d all just kill each other, that’d be fine. If the Izzies loosed a nuke on the Hezzies and turned the whole region into a vitrified, poisonous desert, folks might just stop fucking with each other over an insignificant hunk of dirt. If we could just get Olmert and Ahmadinejad to strap their wrists together and knife fight to a Michael Jackson tune, we could sell it on Pay-Per-View. Shit, if we just nuked the entire region, we could get the oil monkey off our backs the hard way. Personally, I’m so fucking sick of Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Brotherhood, Likud, and the IDF, all these unevolved, pitiful excuses for human beings who can’t sit down and talk to one another without mention of who did what to whom, what/whom, what/whom back to the fucking stone age. They’re the fucking same people, semites all, supposedly even the descendants of Isaac and Ishmael, two brothers. Jeebus, they need to be spanked all around and I’m guessing, were it not for AIPAC- and the prevailing attitude towards Islam at the moment, maybe we would. One can dream.
28 July 2006, on 1:20 am
Raindog–
Unfortunately, there is no cycle of violence in the Middle East. Hamas, the Party of God, and Islamic Jihad, like the Iranian Ayatollahs, have all sworn to destroy Israel and will not stop until every Jew in the region is dead. This is action with purpose; more like an arrow than a cycle.
Of the Jews in Israel, 43% define themselves as secular, which is far, far higher than what we have here in the States. Progressive-minded individuals have a duty to stand with them when they suffer killings and kipnappings from organizations like the Party of God (the Hezb’Allah).
28 July 2006, on 1:51 am
President Bush sent a message to the gathering praising Mr. Hagee and his supporters for “spreading the hope of God’s love and the universal gift of freedom.”
Holy fuck we have the sorriest excuse for a president in the history of the world.
28 July 2006, on 2:10 am
But Bowden… Mideast politics and history aside — I have a plethora of issues with what you just said, but let’s narrow the focus of the argument for a second — I have asked you this time and again. How do you reconcile standing alongside these people who are also calling it a holy war? What are you doing to separate your position from this pack of maniacs?
28 July 2006, on 2:48 am
Sean–
If by ‘pack of maniacs’ we’re referring to the groups of Christians in the United States who see Middle Eastern violence as the end of times, they’re dangerous for several reasons. The biggest is that there is nothing that guarantees that our side wins at the end of the day; it is entirely possible for Islam to rule the world in the future.
With respect to the Israelis, if they were waging a Holy War against its neighbors, why have they been returning land, leasing countless numbers of terrorists for the return of the bodies of dead soldiers, forcibly removing thousands of settlers and so forth? Moreover, wouldn’t Israel expel and/or exterminate its Muslim population first? (Over 16% of Israelis are members of Islam.)
The truth is that Israel has many leftwing secular people, too many perhaps. Why many secular individuals around the world think that that giving peace a chance with genocidal Muslim terror gangs like the Party of God is one of the great mysteries of the universe. Nevertheless, I’m glad Israel is taking a more realistic approach today, and that my government is on the same page. I’m not convinced someone like Hillary or even Feingold would have a different policy.
28 July 2006, on 2:55 am
Ignore the spelling and grammar weirdness in my last post; the point is clear.
28 July 2006, on 3:03 am
Bowden: How many Jews have died in the struggle for Palestine compared to the number of Arabs?
Get a grip on reality, you Zionist fucktard.
28 July 2006, on 7:40 am
I think the only good thing that could come out of this war, if it were to continue to its end, would be the breaking of the back of religion when no god/gods show up. And I think that most of us
know that will happen.
As far as finding a balance between faith and reason, Carl Sagan would turn over in his grave if he heard that. I could only chuckel a bit when I heard that pipe dream. I agree with Lynda, its not even worth the thought. By reasoning you should come to the conclusion that you are entertaining a trojan horse.
28 July 2006, on 7:42 am
Hagee looks like he could hold a lot of egg on his face!
28 July 2006, on 9:43 am
Jack Says:
I think the only good thing that could come out of this war, if it were to continue to its end, would be the breaking of the back of religion when no god/gods show up. And I think that most of us
know that will happen.
As far as finding a balance between faith and reason, Carl Sagan would turn over in his grave if he heard that. I could only chuckel a bit when I heard that pipe dream. I agree with Lynda, its not even worth the thought. By reasoning you should come to the conclusion that you are entertaining a trojan horse.
Jack: That was quite eloquent.
28 July 2006, on 10:06 am
Bowden, while I sort of agree with you, I think you fail to see the big picture.
The rise and spread of militant Islamic fundamentalism is a form of response and blowback to Western imperialism and influence. This goes back to the end of World War One and the fall of the Ottoman Empire. In the wake of the collapse of the Ottomans, the British and the French set up their mandates in the Middle East, which essentially meant that they controlled the territories or set up Arab rulers to do it for them by proxy.
The impetus behind the Balfour Declaration was that the British believed that a Jewish state in Palestine would be pro-British and help to strengthen Britain’s influence in the region. What they did not count on was that the Arabs who lived in Palestine did not take to kindly to this.
This is why many Arabs were pro-Nazi during World War Two, just as the Chechens were. The Germans represented a force for eliminating British and French colonial influence in the region. After World War Two, with the rise of American power and the onset of the Cold War, American foreign policy in the region, like that of Britain before it, was to maintain friendly governments in the region, regardless of their human rights records. So, we supported the fundamentalist Saudi monarchy while overthrowing the democratically elected Mossadegh government in Iran and replacing him with the despotism of the Shah. Since most Americans are ignorant of history, they do not know these things, but you can bet that the Arabs and the Iranians know these things pretty well.
Now mind you, just because a lot of the terrorism we and Israel are facing represents a form of blowback does not mean that I think we should just sit there quietly and take it. What I do mean though is that we need to understand ultimately that it is a form of blowback and choose our responses carefully so as to isolate and eliminate the radical Islamists without essentially pouring more gasoline on the fire so to speak.
I have to wrap this up now because I have to start work now, but I wanted to throw this out there for you to chew on.
28 July 2006, on 10:07 am
Humpty Dumpty Hagee better watch his blood pressure. He looks like a prime candidate for a mini explosion himself.
While evangelicals focus their attention on the middle eastern war mongers in their battle between evil and more evil, the Chinese are building a very impressive young army. Somehow I don’t think we have to worry about the Muslims ruling the world.
28 July 2006, on 10:50 am
I agree Lynda, while we are focusing so much attention on fighting Islamic terrorism, when there is zero chance of Muslims conquering America and forcing us all to convert, China gets to go on about the business of strengthening itself.
28 July 2006, on 11:08 am
I think it would behoove us, as a nation, hell, as a globe, to look upon these terrorist organizations as more Gambino, Genovese, or, more appropriately, the ruthless Russian Mob, and less like armies lined up against us. Trying to engage these sorts with our cold war military is an exercise in futility. I know John Kerry was vilified for specualting this very thing in a NYTimes article prior to the 2004 election but it’s true. This is a crime problem, not a war problem, and, in it, the Israelis are vigilantes working outside international law. Remember Mr. Bowden, that the Israelis, Ben Gurion, Dayan, Rabin, etc. engaged in terrorist acts at the nation’s inception so there is definitely a cycle, a tit for tat going on here. And, while the Hezzies fling completely unreliable rockets at the Izzies, the Izzies disproportionate response- essentially destroying Southern Lebanon, maiming and killing civilians, and shelling a UN observer post differs from a suicide bomber at a Tel Aviv busstop how?
Oh, and because they are, what 43% secular, I’m supposed to give them a pass?
28 July 2006, on 12:37 pm
Does someone know why christians are behind the jews, I thought gawd would still be pissed off at the jews for killing his son!
I know I would. Oh yeah! gawd forgives all.
28 July 2006, on 12:59 pm
Tommy, do you not think that the slow but steady democratization of China, the rampant private enterprise, the exploding economy, make it more likely that China’s tenure as superpower will differ little from our own- except in Chinese, of course? Truly, if they wished us ill will, they could simply call in the massive debt of ours that they hold and, essentially, bring us to our knees. And, BTW, their military is already superior to ours in terms of boots on the ground, roughly equal to ours in missile technology, and only lags behind in the increasingly archaic category of ungainly hardware like subs, aircraft carriers, tanks, etc.
28 July 2006, on 1:37 pm
Sean–
Your point is like saying if the Japanese kill 2400 Americans in Pearl Harbor, the Americans would be in the wrong if their response entails more than 2400 Japanese deaths. I’m not certain what principle is supposed to justify this idea.
28 July 2006, on 1:42 pm
Raindog–
I’m not certain what a proportional response by Israel is supposed to entail. If Israel should being exactly proportional, they should kill only a handful of Party of God members, kidnap two of them, and then simply fire Iranian-supplied rockets into civilian areas until they get what they want.
What should this make sense? By what standard, I inquire? Enlighten me.
28 July 2006, on 4:37 pm
“I’m not certain what a proportional response by Israel is supposed to entail. If Israel should being exactly proportional, they should kill only a handful of Party of God members, kidnap two of them, and then simply fire Iranian-supplied rockets into civilian areas until they get what they want.”- J.H. Bowden
First off, why should they- the Israelis, get what they want? Because they happen to have US supplied military toys and a crack military? Because might, indeed, makes right?
My main point is that we- and Israel, hold ourselves to a higher standard in terms of justice, or we used to anyway. Whether it’s negligence, a technical glitch in the guidance systems of their weaponry, or just flat out apathy on the IDF’s part, killing innocent men, women, and children makes them exactly no better than the wanton, Palestinian suicide bombers they rightfully bemoan in their own midst.
If the Israelis insist on rooting out all of Hezbollah in Lebanon- and let’s assume that’s their right, then they ought to do it in a manner worthy of a responsible democratic nation. House to house, urban guerrilla warfare, and pick ‘em off one by one without the indefensible ruination of an already impoverished area’s infrastructure. Would this mean casualties for the IDF? Probably, but, hey, they’re soldiers in a war and that’s their job.
War from a distance makes war all too easy for the button pushers when it should be so torturous as to make it the hardest decision one has to make. Any national leader, any politician voting to go to war or declaring one ought to have to offer up every member of their family for military service- and not the Texas Air National Guard(though in Dear Leader’s defense, the Vietcong never made a successful incursion across the Rio Grande), the boots on the ground sort.
I refer you back to my earlier comment on the terrorist organization as crime family- okay, crime family with bigger guns. If our law enforcement personnel killed as indiscriminately as the IDF- yes, I know, the Hezzies do too but they’re the outlaws- they’d be in jail themselves. Fighting an out of uniform, stateless foe is not warfare. If Israel wants a war, fine, go take out Ahmadinejad. Taking out Southern Lebanon proves nothing and probably won’t even disrupt Hezbollah much.
29 July 2006, on 1:19 am
Christians are behind the Jews because we/they worship the same God, and because the Bible says they are God’s chosen people. The odd thing about it all to me, anyways is that the Jews still have to choose to accept Christ in order for salvation.
Hezbollah has been reportedly (although they won’t admit it) refusing to allow evacuations of people from battle zones so that they can make Israel look more like bloodthirsty murderers.
Hope this answers a couple questions.
Goodluck, Godbless, and Godspeed.
29 July 2006, on 4:41 am
Hey, Cieje3. Did you know you also worship Allah, too? They’re all the same Abrahamic gawd, you dumb fucking terrorist.
You are one inch away from being banned. Get your goddamn raptureready.com links off our web site, beeyotch.
29 July 2006, on 10:15 am
Christians are behind the Jews because we/they worship the same God, and because the Bible says they are God’s chosen people. The odd thing about it all to me, anyways is that the Jews still have to choose to accept Christ in order for salvation.
This is the kind of thinking that is the cause of most warring. Even though the xians would like to see the Jews win, they will then turn on them because they reject the “jeebus” branch of the tangled mythologies. If there were no Hezbollah, it would be some other group. Even xians battle xians, like in N. Ireland. Protestants against catholics, then if we got rid of one side or another it would be various sects within Protestant or catholic who would be warring. We need to GET RID OF RELIGION…IT KEEPS FUCKING UP THE WORLD AND ANY HOPES FOR PEACE.
29 July 2006, on 10:33 am
Eve wrote to Cieje3 in another comment thread: “So many of them then turn around, either almost immediately or after lulling us into a sense of security, and violate our comment policies or otherwise behave inappropriately given what they’ve told us their intentions are. I’m not saying that you’re going to do that; I sincerely hope not and like Sean, I welcome another “friendly” theist voice. However, I’ve been figuratively stabbed in the back before, so as a guest on our site, you will understand, I’m sure, when I say that I remain skeptical toward new theist commenters until they’ve shown more of themselves.”
Sean, Eve…I think Cieje3 is providing yet another example as to why we do not trust xian commentors. Most have been dishonest about their intentions at the beginning and then when they get a foot in the door it doesn’t take them long to start proselytizing.
29 July 2006, on 1:54 pm
I only intended to help answer a question posted above by mimetic.
Allah, IS NOT the same as GOD/Jehovah. I will, MODs willing post proof at a later time. (Mods, please send me a private email with DETAILED guidelines for commenting thank you.)
Calling me a terrorist is completely uncalled for, as is accusing me of proselytizing. I made no attempt to convert or preach, much less threaten hellfire and brimstone. I simply answered a question to the best of my ability. If I am to be banned simply for making a disagreeing, bible-quote free comment, then so be it. Calling me a four-legged canine? I’ve had worse. And also, I’m almost disappointed you hadn’t called me an @$$#@+ (asshat) yet.. (That one makes me laugh each time I see it. In fact if I ever find a hat that looks like a pair of buttcheeks, or a donkey for that matter, I’ll buy it immediately.)
For the record, I’m not a huge fan of Hagee either. He just creeps me out.
ALSO, I do not know how the heck it is I’ve put links to Raptureready on YOUR site other than where the box “Website” appears above the comment box. I simply put it’s address there since I don’t have a homepage of my own. I have deleted it for the posting of this comment. If that doesn’t fix the problem, I dunno what to tell you. My expertise as it were, is more along that of video games.
I have done my best to abide by your commenting policies, and have been walking on eggshells since I started “lurking” here. I am just as annoyed as anyone else when religious freaks start pounding on your door on sunday afternoons and bothering you (even when you tell them you’re a Christian) about their version of God; so I have been going through each of my posts here with a fine-toothed comb, so to speak.
Did I forget to mention that most of my offline friends are non religious? I certainly don’t harass THEM. I am just as polite and caring for them as I am towards you guys. I get picked on for being such a “softie”, “Fag”, or “tree-hugging hippie”. I was hoping that I would be seen similarly here.
I must admit that the personal attacks hurt a bit, but if I am truly not welcomed here, then let it be. I tried my best to hang with you guys, but if I’m banned despite it all, It’s been fun.
And as usual, Goodluck, Godbless, and Godspeed.
29 July 2006, on 1:57 pm
OOPS! I forgot to leave off my “signature” on the last post.
Sorry. Force of habit.
How’s about this one?
I hate this planet, Glad I’m just visiting.
29 July 2006, on 2:12 pm
I hate this planet, Glad I’m just visiting.
Like I wrote in response to another place you posted this in your comment, why don’t you just volunteer to go fight in the holy lands and become a martyr for jeebus and you end your “visit” here since you hate the world so much and leave it in peace to those who LOVE LIFE? The last part of your comment is indeed “indirect proseltyzing”…and see the COMMENTING link at the top of the page for website rules on commenting. Thanks.
29 July 2006, on 2:29 pm
Allah, IS NOT the same as GOD/Jehovah. I will, MODs willing post proof at a later time.
Allah, God, Jehovah…they are all the same gawd of the Abrahamic religions.
In the study of comparative religion, an Abrahamic religion is any of those religions deriving from a common ancient Semitic tradition and traced by their adherents to Abraham (”Father/Leader of many” Hebrew אַבְרָהָם Arabic ابراهيم), a patriarch whose life is narrated in the Hebrew Bible/Old Testament, and as a prophet in the Qur’an and also called a prophet in Genesis 20:7. This forms a large group of largely monotheistic religions, including Judaism, Christianity, Islam and the Bahá’í Faith. Abrahamic religions account for more than half of the world’s total religious adherents. Many adherents of these religions, however, will reject this grouping of their faiths on the grounds that they contain inherently and fundamentally incompatible ideas concerning Abraham and concerning God.
29 July 2006, on 6:22 pm
You’re probably wasting your breath, JH. Raindog is as much a fundamentalist in his way as the Pat Robertsons and John Hagees of the world are in theirs.
29 July 2006, on 8:00 pm
MegaTroopX,
Excuse me?
30 July 2006, on 3:14 am
Stardust:
“Many adherents of these religions, however, will reject this grouping of their faiths on the grounds that they contain inherently and fundamentally incompatible ideas concerning Abraham and concerning God.”
Grouping ALL of these together is kinda like grouping athiesm with satanism. In fact, I made a comment on a subject like that posted elsewhere here. The difference.. I apparently cannot go into without violating the commenting policies.
And about the whole visiting thing? I honestly thought it would be a funny anectdote on my own unpopular beliefs, I.E. to make fun of myself in spite of myself..
There was a time I considered myself humorous.. Today you have proven me wrong. Thank you.
Also, for the record: Although I freely admit to being a Christian,(and believe each word of the Bible) I DO NOT necessarily like the idea of being a martyr, and definitely DO NOT HATE LIFE. I finally started speaking up on this site because I have become fed up with most of the behaviors of ALL RELIGIOUS groups (including mine) and what they have all collectively done to the world’s social networks. I feel that if any one religion TRULY was the ONE, that they would be smart enough to not endlessly bother people to death; and simply attract new followers the same way one would attract friends.. I.E. By being decent people, friendly, etc..
I have stated as such before that I was pretty much a tree-hugging hippie type before I was a believer and I pretty much still AM.
Let’s not forget that I’m still a NEWBIE here, so would you please cut me some slack?
Oh, and I’m a pacifist.
How so?
If i’m not careful I might just pacifist right through someone.
Sorry another lame attempt at humor.
30 July 2006, on 3:53 am
Let me ask an honest question, Cieje3: What do you want to accomplish here? Please be truthful and upfront in your response. I know it may seem unfair to prejudge you, but from our past experience, theists have often lied to us. Since you were originally linking your name to the straight-up EVIL raptureready.com, you have already lost a few points. To gain them back I suggest you do two things in short order: Name your intent on this web site — and then act on it.
30 July 2006, on 10:50 am
Cieje3 - Did you actually READ and UNDERSTAND the link I provided about Abrahamic religions in comment #34?
It seems that you did not take my link seriously and make feeble attempts at joking it off. I have studied World Religion at the college level and if you too did some research you would find that Christianity is one of the religions in the group of largely monotheistic religions, including Judaism, Islam and the Bahá’í Faith that was derived from a common ancient Semitic tradition and traced by their adherents to Abraham (”Father/Leader of many” Hebrew אַבְרָהָם Arabic ابراهيم), a patriarch whose life is narrated in the Hebrew Bible/Old Testament, and as a prophet in the Qur’an and also called a prophet in Genesis 20:7.
Whether you reject other religions that were derived from this common ancient Semitic tradition is beside the point.
30 July 2006, on 11:19 am
Let me ask an honest question, Cieje3: What do you want to accomplish here?
Sean, My vibes tell me that Cieje3 is here to “play” with us.
1 August 2006, on 10:06 pm
Sean: I have spent the past two days thinking over your question and have an answer. (it took me a while to find this topic again, tho.) I simply want to be able to come here and vent about a lot of the BS i’ve been through with religious people and groups in the past, throw in my two cents worth on your myriad of topics, and also would like to join in the heckling of people of my own faith. I love to joke around and rip on others as much as the next guy/gal and don’t be surprised if I nudge YOU from time to time.(actually, I already have! tee hee) I’ts all in fun though.
If I can make a new friend or two in the process, then awesome.
I hope this is enough of a mission statement.
1 August 2006, on 10:23 pm
Stardust:
I did INDEED read and understand the link you gave me, though it was mostly a review of things I already knew.
To summarize the whole kit and kiboodle of the Abrahamic religion(s) mess, basically the belief system was imitated and duplicated several times over. As I understand it, many of the other religions in the world over share a lot of similarities.
To further compress my answer: The Jews and Christians “know” what the “true” God is like, and can tell a fake from miles away.
I hope this is a sufficient answer.
Live long and prosper.