Daniel Dennett’s response to Rick Warren’s “A Purpose Driven Life”
1 March 2007 by StardustSome of you may have already seen this video of Daniel Dennett’s presentation at the 2006 TEDTalks since it is over a year old already, but it’s not a topic that will be outdated anytime soon. Whether by coincidence or planned by someone behind the scenes, Dennett ended up speaking directly after super-evangelist Rick Warren. Dennett’s talk was scheduled to be given a couple of days before Warren’s, so it was not meant as a direct response to him. But as it happens, Dennett had a lot to say about where he and Warren disagree.
For those who are not familiar with Daniel Dennett, here is a summary from the director of TEDTalks:
Dan Dennett is a Tufts philosophy professor and cognitive scientist, renowned for his books, Consciousness Explained (1991) and Darwin’s Dangerous Idea (1995). His most recent book, Breaking the Spell: Religion as a natural phenomenon calls for a rational examination of religion as a cultural phenomenon that has co-evolved over milennia to meet human needs. In this talk, which followed the presentation by Pastor Rick Warren, he takes issue with some of Warren’s claims in The Purpose-Driven Life.
From Wikipedia: In October 2006, Dennett was hospitalized because of a dissection of the aorta. After a nine-hour surgery, he was given a new aorta and aortic arch. As of November, he was recuperating from the surgery. In an essay posted on the Edge website, Dennett gives his firsthand account of his health problems, his consequent feelings of gratitude towards the scientists and doctors whose hard work made his recovery possible, and his complete lack of a “deathbed conversion”.
1 March 2007, on 3:53 am
Since I first listened to Dennett, he is my hero. This is an extremely interesting long interview with him.
1 March 2007, on 4:52 am
I listened to the first 5 minutes of the lecture…and I am 100 pages into “Breaking the Spell.” Dennett is a homerun.
1 March 2007, on 9:50 am
stardust,great post! his new book is excellent
he’s also writen some column’s for free inquiry.In november of 2006 I went to a lecture
by Paul Kurtz in S.F.,it was held at one of the
swank hotel’s in chinatown.Their partner’s in crime (so to speak).This summer I plan to attend the “beyod belief” summer session’s
being held at center for inquiry Amhurst
then it’s off to the Robert Ingersoll museum
in dresden.It’s about a two hour drive from Amhurst.
ric warren what a crashing bore!I simply despise these mega-church despot’s.
1 March 2007, on 10:03 am
This is the first time I’ve listened to Dennett. He speaks very well, and as far as religion goes, is right on the mark, as far as I’m concerned.
However, if he thinks Al Gore speaks the truth about Global Warming (he mentions this briefly), he is deluded. There is absolutely ZERO science which supports Gore’s propaganda, ZERO!
I know I go on and on about this, but it’s simply amazing to me that people will believe Al Gore and not the science. Al Gore majored in Theology, and he’s using that knowledge to preach his global warming sermon to a willing crowd. Regardless of what you may think about me, the science, as reported by the UN’s IPCC even, does NOT support catastrophic ANYTHING, even at the upper estimates. And observed climate patterns do not support the IPCC projections based on computer models.
My point: Dennett needs to look as critically at subjects he’s going to mention as he does with religion.
1 March 2007, on 12:02 pm
Of the axis of atheist evil (Dawkins, Dennett, and Harris), Dennett is by far the most interesting. Rather than confronting religious belief as something that must be combated in modern society, Dennett would rather subject it to rational study and figure out why it evolved, what evolutionary advantages it has for humans, and how it will possibly evolve in the future. Of course, that’s still pretty menacing to theists, but Dennett is dead on when he advocates requiring study of all religious belief in schools. Breaking the spell is often no more complicated than removing the monopoly that your parents religious belief has on you.
1 March 2007, on 1:06 pm
Reverant
I’m a little confused. Do you believe global warming is happening and that Gore is full of it? Or that global warming isnt a threat?
I for one am very weary of Gore’s intentions, but do believe that global warming is a problem.
1 March 2007, on 2:00 pm
Thanks, Stardust, for highlighting Dennett…whom I consider to be one of the current atheist “triumvirate”; ala: Dawkins (Father); Harris (Son) and…
Dennett (Holy Ghost? or maybe just Santa Claus?)
In this particular talk; Dennett seemed to be just a wee bit too courteous to, what I consider to be, one of the most dangerous Fundies ‘out there’, in terms of his popular book’s effect on a massive following.
Of course, Dennett was speaking right after Warren finished HIS bullshit, and probably was bending over backwards to be gentlemanly nice!. Dennett IS a marvelous lecturer; no surprise, considering his distinguished professorial track record.
I guess I was expecting more “Blood & Guts” (going directly for the jugular?)
“Harrh! Harrh!…slurp!”
Actually, speaking of Warren’s BS, godisimaginary.com, if I recall, does a pretty good textual hatchet job on his “Porpoise Driven Strife”.
[Sorry, Porpoisi!...?] “Screech!, Screech!”
As to Dennett; for a whole series of his 2006 lectures, here’s his ‘main’ YouTube page:
http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Daniel+Dennett&search=Search
1 March 2007, on 2:44 pm
I believe the global climate is constantly changing, and that there is no evidence to believe anything we’re seeing today, or for the last 30 years, is outside the range of normal variability.
Take, for example, Sea Level rise. The average rate of sea level rise to the best of our knowledge for the last few thousand years has been approximately 1.5mm/year. The rate for the last 30 years has been right about there. Actually from the 1900s to 1950s the rate was higher, so we’ve actually seen a decrease in the rate of sea level rise in the last 30-40 years. At the current rate, there’s no way in hell we’re going to see sea levels rise 20 feet in our lifetimes. The IPCC’s latest upper level “estimate” (totally based on computer models) is 43 cm by the end of 2100. Gore’s prognostications are 2000% higher than that. Who are you going to believe? Even given an increase to 2mm/year, we’re looking at only 20cm rise in sea levels by the end of 2100. Hardly a catastrophe, and totally within the realm of natrual variability.
We shouldn’t be wasting time on carbon trading scams which, even if totally adhered to, would not have any measurable effect on the global temperature. Instead we should be finding ways of helping developing countries here and now feed their starving and heal their sick, and live better lives, and adapt to inevitable climate change, be it warm or cold (cold is MUCH more likely, and MUCH more deadly).
1 March 2007, on 4:24 pm
Re: “We shouldn’t be wasting time on carbon trading scams which, even if totally adhered to, would not have any measurable effect on the global temperature. Instead we should be finding ways of helping developing countries here and now feed their starving and heal their sick, and live better lives, and adapt to inevitable climate change, be it warm or cold (cold is MUCH more likely, and MUCH more deadly).”
———
Now I can agree with that, but I also have great concerns with desertification, because some of the worst human behaviors have and are devoloping there, that are spreading out to other countries and has for some time now. Behavior that will only lead to the end of humanity and many other species to boot. I don’t believe the earth itself is in any real danger. Shit, she will shake us off like fleas and keep going. Those that can adapt will live and those that cant will die out. If humans dont wake up, will not adapt.
I dont know what can be done to stop desertification, but it is a HUGE problem in India and many Middle Eastern countries. There are a few scientists working on it, but some of them are in question for some of their far out beliefs or ideas about physics and the rest are just stumped. But what they do know for sure is that dry inhospitable conditions cause undernurished,undernutured, underdeveloped brains that lead to crazy beliefs(i.e biblical beliefs)and very oppressive and aggressive behaviors towards others. Think about all the Muslim imagrants in Europe right now and their numbers are growing. One born in drought and famine that makes it out alive will eventually migrate out and force their views on the rest of the world. This has been going on for about 6000 years now. Our lush land of plenties have helped balance them out somewhat, but lelf with out proper parenting skills.
I better stop here cuz I dont want to hijack Stardusts topic about Dennis Dennett. Who I happen to agree with about teaching all religions in historical context.
1 March 2007, on 4:35 pm
I found that a refreshing surprise. I, too, was expecting something more confrontational, but as I watched, I realized that he would have more sway than some of those youtube videos I watched a while back where the narrator kept saying stuff like, “Anybody with half a brain and a smidge of common sense would know that believing in God is really, really stupid and a waste of time.” I have a hard time thinking we’re going to convince anybody that atheists are nice, moral, friendly people when we yell at the theists about how idiotic they are. I think Dennett makes us look good.
1 March 2007, on 5:15 pm
As far as I’m concerned about global warming, I think certain groups wanting to push certain agendas have latched onto this and turned it into a panic akin to the Y2K thing. Some of what they want to do would destroy the economy anyway (want to guess how much prices would sore in response to gas prices becoming 4 dollars a gallon?)
Anyway, according to this, the entire solar system is getting warmer. http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread221608/pg1
1 March 2007, on 8:39 pm
Marcy: “I have a hard time thinking we’re going to convince anybody that atheists are nice, moral, friendly people when we yell at the theists about how idiotic they are. I think Dennett makes us look good.”
I don’t actually disagree with that. First of all, though, I don’t think it’s just about convincing people that we’re Mr./Ms. “Nice Guys”. It’s more importantly about pointing out the dangerous flaws which come from literalist religions, and believers’ lack of critical thinking that have, in the past, and continue today, to set in motion the warring, etc., between us earthlings.
My joking comment:
“I guess I was expecting more “Blood & Guts” (going directly for the jugular?)
“Harrh! Harrh!…slurp!”…
was rhetorical…you know…like humor…and meant for here…on GifS?
No yelling, or ‘ad hominems’ were expected.
Obviously “yelling” is not going to accomplish anything…on either side.
Whose encouraging yelling, by the way? Even on godisimaginary.com, the narrator isn’t really “yelling”! By the way, I’m not trying to sell any particular mode of getting the message across…
Remember: “Different strokes, for different folks”? Or…NOT!
As to the written word on the internet…THIS IS YELLING! (IN OTHER WORDS…LENGTHY CAPITALIZATION); when used constantly…and I’ve seen more of that from fundie trolls than anyone else.
My point is more about being ‘balanced’, and most of all rational…using critical thinking.
I really have no problem with Dennett…he ALWAYS makes atheism…and atheists…look good!
That particular video just seemed…for my taste…to not quite get ‘at’, if you will, the critical substance of what’s wrong with Warren’s multi-million blockbuster bullshit. No yelling or name calling was needed, of course!
It finally dawned on me, actually, that his talk was never really meant to have anything to do with Warren’s book…it was a schedualing fluke that brought up those expectations; i.e. only because he followed Warren’s talk.
Dennett’s talk was, essentially, very much like one from his other 2006 series, that I linked to.
[Anyone check my YouTube Dennett link?]
I’m sure Dennett and any of the other major reps of atheism [Dawkins, Harris, etc.] don’t go around yelling or telling people how stupid they are.
That’s our job here at GifS!
I’M KIDDING, MARCY! WHAT!…ARE YOU A STUPID ATHEIST, OR SOMETHING?
Sorry, Marcy…I apologize…I didn’t mean to ‘yell’…
and obviously, you’re NOT stupid…
Hey…you’re a GifS atheist!
2 March 2007, on 1:26 am
Well, I have a hard time keeping my patience (especially when I’m PMSing) with christians. And especially when it comes to that stupid debate about morality. I have gotten to the point where I just tell them flat out my morals and values are better than theirs.
I think trying to be nice and debate civily only leads to circular arguments, which is exactly where they want you. They do it to confuse and minipulate in hopes of sucking you in. And its about damn time people really started questioning and even ridiculing their beliefs, because it is their beliefs that have hurt so many people, but most of all so many children. And it doesn’t help that I have been in a very cynical mood lately.
But, I still agree that all religions should be taught in the proper context.
2 March 2007, on 11:24 pm
Revenant makes a good point. The global warming controversy is not yet a knockout win for one side. There are numerous eminent scientists who maintain, as Revenant does, that we are witnessing perfectly normal fluctuations. What amuses me — because I’m a mean old man — is it matters little which side is correct if climate change becomes drastic. Go beyond a certain point and it’s bye-bye homo sapiens sapiens. (No big loss to my way of thinking.)
5 March 2007, on 2:51 am
His pie chart of religions doesn’t include Judaism, unless it’s included in the remaining 3% labeled “Other.” I’m surprised Mr. Dennet, or someone in the audience for that matter, didn’t catch.
5 March 2007, on 3:23 am
Todd - Jews are about 0.22% …therefore are probably included in the 3% labeled other.
Check out this pie chart that includes it…it’s a tiny sliver.
5 March 2007, on 12:01 pm
Absolutely, Old Viking. Another ice age would inevitably mean the deaths of billions, but not all. It’s hard to say what might happen. But I can’t imagine any technology we now have that would prevent the inexorable advance of mile-thick glaciers. And it inevitably WILL happen, while it’s not at all certain that warming will continue.
5 March 2007, on 8:18 pm
I think we need all types of atheists, from those with the take-no-prisoners approach to those with the nice-guy strategy. This will probably never be a conflict with a single front…
7 March 2007, on 6:35 pm
Frankly, I found his lecture rather disappointing; had been delivered by someone other than Dennett it would have been dismissed as lightweight.