Did any of you happen to catch yesterday’s Hardball with yet another debate between atheist Bush lover Christopher Hitchens and big-mouthed Al Sharpton? If not, below are three YouTube videos of the entire program.
I forced myself to sit and watch the entire thing and just took an extra blood pressure pill afterwards. Sharpton has serious diarrhea of the mouth. Hitchens, while I may not agree with him on his political stance, could at least express his point in an intelligent manner, whereas Mr. Media-Attention-Whore-Loud-Mouth barely let Hitchens have a word in edgewise much of the time. I particularly didn’t like Chris Matthews’ sarcastic comments aimed at Hitchens at the close of the program (not on the YouTube video, but I am trying to find it somewhere.)
Overall, for me, it was an extreme overdose of religion/anti-religion dialogue and anti-war from the fundie side, and right-wing politics and pro-war comments coming from the atheist side… very weird interview.
Part 1
6/28/07 Christopher Hitchens and Al Sharpton Hardball pt2
After a question from an audience member about Bush invading Iraq because God told him, in a typical god-botherer defense, Sharpton basically says that Bush was “misquided”…not misguided by his sky daddy. Typical sort of response we expect from imaginative Xians.
6/28/07 Christopher Hitchens and Al Sharpton Hardball pt3
I loved when Hitchens put the smack-down on “Jibberish boy” which the person recording this unfortunately cut out…it was quite awesome to see an atheist shut up a Xian on public television for once..
Even I wouldn’t go so far as to be Pro-war, lol. I do think we would have had to take Saddam out eventually, if only for the whining of the Saudis and others in the region, but there was definitely no planning here.
I made a point to get home in time to watch this. I adore Hitch (even though I think he was wrong on the war) and was expecting him to slaughter the “rev.” Sharpton. I do think Hitch made much more sense, but over all I was disappointed. He could have destroyed Sharpton. At one point Sharpton was going on about “If you say God didn’t make gravity, then where does it come from?” The correct answer for that is “I don’t know.” You then follow that up with “and neither do you, but that is no reason to say godidit. If the course of human history has taught us anything it’s that we have a tendency to ascribe the unknown to the unknowable.”
Hitch, regardless of your opinion of his politics (and I would never call him a “Bush-lover”), is one of the most articulate people on the planet. He has a mastery of the English language like no one else anywhere and is an amazing debater. Unfortunately, he didn’t bring his A-game yesterday.
I caught that show, too. You pretty much nailed the analysis of the proceedings, Stardust.
One thing that stuck out, in my mind, was Sharpton’s sort of weaseling around on any rational source of his notion of the existence of ‘his’ Gord. It’s as if he just knows there’s a deity; having no connection with any typical doctrinal reason for that notion; such as the basis being the Bible. I don’t think Sharpton, or Hitchens, brought up the point that ‘believing’ is usually the FIRST thing taught to people as children; having absolutely no basis in any scientific evidence whatsoever. Sharpton, even though a Christian minister, stayed away, rather carefully, from talking about the Bible being any ‘reason’ for HIS believing. Hitchens. as he’s done elsewhere, did poke at the ‘Reverend’ moniker giving inordinate status to those ‘wearing’ it.
Hmmm…Reverend Stardust…Reverend ChuckA…Reverend Revenant?
[Etcetera…all you GifSters…of course!]
“Nice!”
[Midnight the cat…again?]…Oh yeah!
I guess the ‘good news’ in all this, is that, gradually, more and more attention is being given on prominent, prime time venues, like the Chris Mathews ’show’.
Personally, I’d rather see Hitchens being interviewed…ALONE…for a complete hour…without having to argue with a constantly interrupting adversary.
One thing that stuck out, in my mind, was Sharpton’s sort of weaseling around on any rational source of his notion of the existence of ‘his’ Gord.
“Weasling” that describes Sharpton perfectly. He’s a loud-mouthed weasel.
If you want to see the last part of the interview go to onegoodmove.org (great site btw). It is one of todays (6-29-07) posts. Not too much to see besides more of the good Rev. trying to bully Hitchens and failing, along with Matthews being a dick.
Hi,(Off topic)
Just been reading the usual anti-atheiest comments on some website or other. Apparently we are somehow bullying the religionists though we have no priests , bishops, popes, cathedrals, churches, monasteries, TV channels, no hymns, no access to schools, military, government, etc (nor do we want these). Just a few proponents Dawkins, Hitchens etc and just a few books in comparison to the tens (hundreds?) of thousands of religious books. We have started no crusades, inquisitions.
All the same imagine the hope we bring to those that are trapped in fundie families or societies, just to know that we are out there!!
And, lest we forget, it was Sharpton’s contribution the the Tawana Brawley hoax that rocketed him to fame!
Matthews is always a dick. Keeps claiming people don’t answer questions, because he won’t fucking shut up long enough.
What bugs me the most is he delights in pronouncing Cheney’s name a specific way, saying it’s the “right” way, but can’t pronounce Iraq the right way. Moron.
Rev - I agree…Matthews is a dick. My husband watches it after work every single day so I have to hear that sarcastic whiney-ass voice night after night. I hardly ever watch television, and I definitely don’t normally watch “newsertainment”…I only watched this because I was curious about the Sharpton-Hitchens debate. I heard the MAnn Coulter one the day before, only because he had the volume up and her voice makes my skin crawl. I had to go sit outside after about 5 minute of it because I couldn’t stand it anymore.
Lol, Stardust, I hear ya. Coulter is an ugly, skeletal, hateful bitch, that’s for sure.
Why didn’t he have a “counterpoint” person on against MAnn Coulter…someone who would tell her to STFU? Hey…what a fireworks explosion that would be to have Coulter and Sharpton on at the same time. That would be a fine example of “xian love” from both sides, wouldn’t it?
Even among those who dislike him, Hitchens seems to have this reputation as an “intellectual.”
I’m unclear as to why this is. All Hitchens offers is Limbaugh with a bigger vocabulary.
Hitchens still supports Bush, for Chrissakes. He is still defending the Iraq fiasco. He is still spreading lies and misinformation, trying to link Saddam to 9/11.
He is truly an evil and despicable man.
Anyone who still supports the Iraq War (or Bush) is delusional.
Marc McDonald
BeggarsCanBeChoosers.com
Marc McDonald, what an honor to have an award-winning journalist stop by and comment!
I don’t understand Hitchen’s defense of the Iraq mess and Bush, though even most of the Republican party now realizes and admits that Bush screwed up. The whole interview was quite maddening to watch. Two grown men arguing various topics of fiction and delusion.
ChuckA, I think it’s fair to say that none of the GifS’ Pantheon are “reverended”.
However, try this one: Reverend Slut. (Doesn’t it sound wonderful? I love it!)
Check out the eight responses (#5), here, to her being tagged. And then check here, to find out how to get your very own “reverending permission”…
I find something screwed-up about an atheist supporting the war. Much as I loathe Sharpton (oh, yes, Stardust, Al-the-Mouth is the prototypical Attention-Whore!), I give him one point, for being against the Iraq occupation. If Gord really loved us, he’d strike Al dumb! It’s almost enough to try preyer again, isn’t it?
I find something screwed-up about an atheist supporting the war. Much as I loathe Sharpton (oh, yes, Stardust, Al-the-Mouth is the prototypical Attention-Whore!), I give him one point, for being against the Iraq occupation. If Gord really loved us, he’d strike Al dumb! It’s almost enough to try preyer again, isn’t it?
One point for Sharpton for being against the Iraq occupation, and one point for Hitchens for being an outspoken atheist. However, they both lose those points for being delusional.
I would love it if someone would shut that big-mouth up!
Currently having a rollicking good time reading the audiobook version of God is Not Great by Christopher Hitchens, and though I also disagree with his pro-war stance, I find he soft-pedals it more, at least in that book, than Sam Harris’s book End of Faith, the audiobook version of which, though in the main enjoyable, at times had me yelling back at my car speakers (”OH, PUH-LEEZ–FUCK Alan Dershowitz!” being typical of my utterances, etc). Not so Hitchens, whose eloquence is breathtakingly beautiful at times. Even when I disagree with Hitchens, my reaction is several degrees less emotionally violent than compared to my reaction to Harris in End of Faith; There were sections of End of Faith that were eloquent in their own right, and I think quite correct, and I was at least partly (but not completely) persuaded by much of Harris’s thesis. Personally, I enjoyed much more Harris’s shorter book Letter to a Christian Nation, which was also a rollicking good read in audiobook format, where I had exactly zero disagreemnt with Harris.
Hitchens is NOT “Rush with a bigger vocabulary”. That describes P.J. O’Rourke, not Christopher Hitchens. And I don’t think Hitchens is a “Bush lover”, either.
Nor, to be fair, is Sam Harris.
I am distressed by their nominal “pro-war” stances, I think they over-exaggerate the “Islamic threat”, per se (though on issues of immigration in Europe I’ll grant they make some salient points that are hard to dismiss).
I think also that Harris has decidedly more of an ideological axe to grind than Hitchens.
I’m also a 9/11 Skeptic, while Hitchens and Harris both pretty much accept the “official narrative” without serious question.
If I believed the official story as they do, I might see the world more like they do, but I don’t, so I can’t.
http://oilempire.us
I’ve been a Hardball watcher for sometime, I find Sharpton, though mistaken on many points, an activist for a class of people that needs a voice. I find Hitchins the same in regards to Atheism… so I was intriqued by the confrontation.
I was surprized, for a Hardball debate, at the fact that it was pulled off somewhat well, with both sides (and Matthews) getting their barbs in. Which, as an atheist, I feel Hitchins articulated many points (which we all find commonplace) to a large audience (that don’t think deeply on the no-god topic much) and this will be effective in the greater change happening in america which is promulgated by knowledge in opposed to faith.
I was surprized that Hitchins didn’t jump on the deistic slant that Sharpton opened up. Maybe it’s my evangelical upbringing that keeps me clued in on points like that, but when a christian states that each persons personal take is their way to god, that’s an open door to barge into their delusion.
1. they probably will have to recant and claim christ the only way,
or 2. end up deist…. which forces an open world view and less delusion.
Stardust, could you lay off the ‘MAnn Coulter’ stuff please? I don’t appreciate the insult when you liken me to her.
Stardust, could you lay off the ‘MAnn Coulter’ stuff please? I don’t appreciate the insult when you liken me to her.
Aesmael, sorry to insult the men here, but she does look like a man in drag. Check out that Adam’s apple
We women don’t want to claim her either. We can just call her a “heartless bitch”…which is a better description, but insults all bitches.
(She does look like a man in drag, though. Check out that Adam’s apple.)
I’m speaking as a transgendered person, actually. Although I would not describe myself as a ‘man in drag’, others might if they wished to degrade me. I figure the more people there are who realise it is Not On to insult people by accusing them of being (or because they are) gender variant, the fewer will listen to the bigots when they pull out their bibles or other source of hot air to justify discrimination or other harm against us.
Besides, like you said there’s enough to say about the vile Ms Coulter without brining anyone else into it. This really should have gone at the front of the comment but, thanks for your consideration.
Aesmael, I keep digging my hole deeper with this one, don’t I! Again my apologies. I see where you are coming from now.
Coulter is just a despicable person…period. (and I better shut up about it now
)
Oh, actually, Stardust, I had only just the other day decided (later than I should have, really) that I need to speak up about all this MAnn Coultering all over the ‘net and I am glad you are the first person I confronted over it - if only everyone were so liberal/inquisitive/open to persuasion!
I have a soft spot for this site, in fact. It was one of Sean’s posts last year that helped me to be more open about myself and to find information letting me know I might be happy with myself in life.
I wish I could shut that trap of yours, Al Sharpton. He is too offensive so he is hiding something. Maybe Hitchins did not want to rip this attention whore to pieces for certain reasons. You know how stupid the public is, so they believe any thing that supports their bullshit ideal, no matter how illogical it is. I know I been cursing a lot more but someone needs to stand up.
Look at Susan B. Anthony and Ghandi, they stood up for their beliefs. I think we should do the same. Nothing will change if these Christians assholes spread their bullshit lies to everyone. I will respect anyone religion, but when its cram down my throat everyday, something has to give.
To all Christians: Maybe if you stop going around pushing everyone around because you have more people, maybe everyone else will respect you.
Surprised no one mentioned the brief clip of Hillary saying she needs her faith.
Surprised no one mentioned the brief clip of Hillary saying she needs her faith.
Barf
The “debate” between Hitchens and Sharpton was so dull and predictable I just found myself staring at the braless and apparently chilly woman in the purple dress. I don’t think I missed anything by tuning those guys out.
In Chicago we know about Jesse Jackson.
In New York they know about Sharpton.
Both of them are media whores.
To have either of them speak for the black person is a joke.
To have Sharpton speak against Imus, and then to do the same type of comments against others and not to have him taken off the air is hypocrisy.
There are so many other commenters that have credibility. To use Sharpton is stupid.