Out of the mouths of babes
14 February 2009 by Stardust
When I was a child and first learned about communion, I was horrified. It was even more grotesque as any horror movies I watched while peeking from beneath a blanket. Eating a dead guy’s body, drinking blood! Gross!
Then later, when I was still a Christian and a Sunday School teacher, I actually was one who engaged in telling horrible things to small children and brainwashing them to believe it was all okay, normal. Now live to regret it. Many of the children sat before me with either puzzled expressions or expressions of horror. And some had lots and lots of questions of which I couldn’t seem to answer very well. Why didn’t I recognize the horrible thing I was implanting in the minds of small children? While Christian parents keep their little ones from seeing scary movies, and violent cartoons, etc. they think that telling them the gruesome stories of Jesus is okay.
The site “Why Won’t God Heal Amputees” has a scenerio that goes like this in the Chapter “Why Do We Eat Jesus?”:
Child: Daddy, what are they doing?
Daddy: Well dear, this part of the service is called communion.
Child: What’s communion?
Daddy: Well, it’s where… Well, it’s… you know, what we do is we eat Jesus’ body to… Well, it’s complicated. Let me see…
Child: We eat Jesus’ BODY???
Daddy: Yes. Well, no, but…
Child: Why do we need to eat Jesus??? I don’t want to eat Jesus!!!
Daddy: No, no, no. It’s OK honey. It’s OK. Be quiet now, don’t cry in church. Shhhh. Shush. Now it’s OK.
Child: But Daddy, I don’t want to eat Jesus!
Daddy: Mom, help me out here.
Mom: Honey, it is a holy sacrament. You see, we eat Jesus’ body and we drink his blood because…
Child: I have to drink his blood too??? Mommy, I don’t want to drink blood!!!
Mom: Honey, calm down! You don’t actually drink his blood.
Child: But that man up there is holding up a cup and he is saying that it is Jesus’ blood! Mommy! I want to leave! I am leaving!
Mom, Dad: No honey! Wait! We can’t leave now!
So what happens to people as they grow older? Why do they come to accept this bizarre ancient ritual as something sacred and beautiful? While the story of Dracula drinking the blood of humans, and cannibalism are things that frightens most people, the ritual of eating Jesus’ body and drinking Jesus’ blood is respected and loved.
WWGHA states:
Because Christians have been participating in the communion rite for many years, they tend to forget just how bizarre this ritual is. But any child sees it with fresh eyes. And many children are, naturally, horrified at the thought of eating Jesus’ body and then drinking his blood. It is grotesque in the extreme and a child implicitly understands that.
So, what happens? Years and years of brainwashing? Parents being trusted to tell them the truth and telling their young ones that it’s okay and nothing at all wrong with it and children accept it because they trust their parents? The point is, when children are small it seems they instinctively know when something is not right, so what the heck happens to make grown-up adults participate in such bizarre rituals?
14 February 2009, on 5:19 pm
Religion switches off the intellect. Thats what the indoctrination does. Used to frequent jihadwatch.com while the site itself is ok, just 5 minutes of looking through it shows you how immature they are, especially the comments. Had an ongoing discussion with a fundie christian bashing islam. Used the same arguments against her and she went nuts. I then decided there was no point in making fun of her so i try to engage her in an intellectual discussion. You could probably predict how it went. When asked specific questions, and to back up her claims my opponent just vanished. Guess she hated logic and facts. But decided to post here because folks here seem to be a much higher on the iq part.
14 February 2009, on 7:37 pm
Yeah…primitive, grotesque myths.
That brings back memories of my first Communion…as a seven year old Catholic. If I recall, the explanation was that “we” ate the body and blood of Christ under the “guise of bread and wine”. The so-called “Transubstantiation” amounts to a “mystical” transformation of the bread and wine, etc. The literal body & blood takes on the outward appearance of bread & wine. Also, the Catholics, because of Papal doctrinal pronouncement, only need to take the host…which, somehow mystically, also contains the blood.
[It's also cheaper, and totally eliminates the alcohol problem!]
IMO, the overwhelming number of adult believers who continue to play along with the ritual, have long ago “swallowed” the doctrine and passed way beyond the childhood indoctrination; and probably just avoid really thinking much about it.
As we all know, however, from the somewhat recent PZ Meyers/Donohue incident, the Catholic literalism regarding the matter…is a REALLY BIG deal. Differing with the Church on that shtick may mean Excommunication.
“oooEEEoooo…verrry scarrry…Booga, booga!”
For many Protestants, of course, it was always symbolic, not literal; so not as much of a big deal as the Catholics, and other similar sects; such as the Greek and Eastern Orthodox.
I think it all goes back to an ancient tribal notion that if you eat the flesh of something…you somehow “spiritually” share the characteristics of whatever the life form was.
Similar to the American Indians eating Bear meat, for example, to gain the strength of that animal.
Sooooo…eating a god…yada, yada.
Thus, like Jeebus, at the last supper…the popular saying…
“Eat Me!” was born…?
(followed,inaudibly of course, by:
“All you totally ignorant, completely delusional, lame-ass, muthafucking Sheeple!”)
14 February 2009, on 9:46 pm
That brings back memories of my first Communion…as a seven year old Catholic. If I recall, the explanation was that “we” ate the body and blood of Christ under the “guise of bread and wine”.
Chuck, Catholics have got to be the most grotesque and gruesome of all the Xian denominations. Their eerie rituals are by far the most bizarre. The Protestant snake-handlers who speak in tongues are pretty weird, however most of them have double digit IQs. However, most Catholics are quite intelligent in many areas. Their schools are supposedly academically superior to public schools. And then there is all this nightmarish horror crap they brainwash their children with. And the children are not supposed to question it, just accept what they are being told to believe as truth.
One thing that I always thought was amusing was communion at Catholic weddings I have attended. People coming up and only getting the wafer, and the priest chug-a-luggin’ the wine. Then at the end cleaning the chalice and putting it away in it’s magical gold-embellished box. Weird, weird, weird!
14 February 2009, on 11:43 pm
^ Just a personal opinion (what else?)…
but it’s kinda like sex…which, no matter how smart people are…ultimately makes fools of us all. We’re all addicted from birth, driven by hormones and even unknown DNA programmings; to follow the dictates of irrational, evolutionary passions; especially when we’re young. In the case of religion, it’s not so much hormonal, but more indoctrination driven.
And…let’s not forget that the whole “notion” of needing some so-called “Magical Savior” for purely imagined and somehow inherited sin, is in itself a pretty “weird” idea.
[Hey...ALL the "Scriptures" are fucking weird!]
The Catholic Xtian variety, being the oldest of the Western traditions, and the closest to all the weird cults that were going on in Rome at the time it supposedly started, incorporated a tad more of the weirdness. If anyone is familiar with some of the Roman cults, via series like HBO’s “Rome”; there were a lot of strange practices by the Romans, using VERY bloody and gruesome rituals. The Church just toned down some of the extremism; but kept enough woo-woo to accomplish the needed “awe” of believers. Of course…you must ALWAYS have “Awe” in the mix!
Even today, we have the use of “awesome” in our popular lingo; and, of course…
“Shock and Awe” in Shrub’s recent war mongering. [And then there's the new "Stimulus" package?]
I realize I’m getting somewhat off topic, but…
Personally, just considering the Universe, when looking at those beautiful Hubble photos, can inspire a sense of awe for some. I tend, when looking at those same pictures, to simultaneously remember that I’m looking at an illusion of beauty (”One that’s in the eye of the beholder”?); looking at the images of millions a billions of years in the past. We never actually see anything much in the present. And the reality, from what we know from Science, is something completely different…creation of Suns, colliding galaxies, black holes, unseen dark matter, etc…and the fact that our Milky Way Galaxy itself, is on a collision course with the galaxy of Andromeda. Of course, some two billion years in the future. But that’s also a bit “shocking…and awesome”…and somewhat scary, too…and even…”weird, weird, weird”?
On that note…
Why would we even WANT to live forever in this weird, baffling Universe…huh?
Even the notion of reincarnation is a scary idea…scary and weird, I’m sure, for a huge chunk of Eastern believers.
Even when I, as New Ager, firmly believed in that concept, I thought the notion a bit horrifying in its indeterminateness. [But that's a whole other (possible) discussion?]
To end my blabbing, I’ll, again, as I’ve done on other Posts, paraphrase good old Nietzsche…
“Existence, itself, is R-E-A-L-L-Y Absurd!”
Or…like the Existentialist’s: “Being and Nothingness”, zama-zama.
Much like Quantum Mechanics…it continues to defy anyone’s real, complete, analytic understanding.
(And suddenly, my reality of a late din-din has broken the spell…the (awesome) whiff of Beef Stroganoff is beckoning me.
“Yum-yum!”)
15 February 2009, on 2:05 am
Another reason why you should join the Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Communion isn’t disgusting or icky at all.
The FSM is delicious! Much tastier than that Jesus guy who tastes like stale crackers.
15 February 2009, on 2:14 am
Since I was raised to believe communion was symbolic rather than transubstantiation, I see now that I should have cast off christianity far sooner than I did had I been raised catholic.
Aside from the horror of communion, I remain amazed that millions of good christian people believe that viewing that pornographic “Passion of the Christ” was a good thing to do.
I do not understand this blood and guilt and suffering required by a god who exists only to be adored and glorified. No such god deserves my respect or allegience – much less adoration.
I cannot worship a god whose actions do not rise to a certain level of human decency.
15 February 2009, on 1:16 pm
In my dictionary “worship” is a dirty word.
15 February 2009, on 3:58 pm
Maybe it’s you heathens that have it all wrong? Maybe it’s a divine tribute to eat someone’s flesh and drink their blood. At least, that’s what my lawyer has been tasked with convincing the jury to believe. If he fails, I’ll just call myself a martyr and that way the Vatican will give me sainthood! “Saint Geoff, the partron saint of blood-lust.”
16 February 2009, on 11:14 am
>i>In my dictionary “worship” is a dirty word.
cry4turtles, mine too! Every time I hear or read the word “worship” it makes me cringe because I picture all of these idiots bowing to an imaginary being and praying magical prayers to nothing. Worship = enslaving oneself to absolutely nothing.
16 February 2009, on 11:33 am
What’s wrong with you all? I love to eat human (or god/human hybrid) flesh! And the blood is delicious! My late pal Jeff Dahmer and I used to … well my eyes are starting to well up here. And my stomach’s gurgling. Yum.
16 February 2009, on 3:05 pm
I wasn’t a raised Catholic, so I have no idea about this. But most horror movies aren’t that gruesome. Sure, you have a few, but most of the gruesome ones I can think of (Dead Alive, The Evil Dead, etc) are just too funny to be the least bit disturbing. But especially in the day of the almighty PG-13, horror movies go for more suspense and tension than gore. In a way, it’s a return to the 70s, in which goreless horror movies like The Texas Chainsaw Massacre and Halloween were hits (Tobe Hooper wanted The Texas Chainsaw Massacre to be PG, but Halloween would still be R because of the nudity, though the violence is tame and the gore nonexistent).
16 February 2009, on 4:57 pm
I remember walking into the Catholic church where some friends of mine got married and they had sculptures throughout the church of the different stages of the crucifixtion. The whole church just came across (to me) as a bloody, gore-fest. I couldn’t imagine taking children to that church. From the life-sized bloody Jesus on the cross at the altar to all the sculptures around the chapel… it was just ghoulish.
So not only do they show all this gore to the kids, but then they make the kids eat the flesh and drink the blood of the gored-up dude.
Wow.
16 February 2009, on 10:37 pm
Cry4turtles–
I’ll one up you and say that, as this post illustrates, in my dictionary, the number two definition of “worship” is “socially sanctioned child abuse.”
If communion is considered metaphore, it’s ludicrous and vacuous; if it’s transubstantiation, it’s grusome and even more ludicrous. Either way, it’s hijacked from earlier blood cults and is wildly anachronistic in any civilized, scientific, post-enlightenment society.
As for Passion of the Crust, mentioned earlier: I hate everything that the wild popularity and success of that movie says about the American public.
17 February 2009, on 2:00 pm
The whole church just came across (to me) as a bloody, gore-fest.
Dan, It is extremely ghoulish! And especially the Catholic churches and cathedrals that have “relics” (dead bodies and body parts) of “saints” they encase in glass boxes and put on display for all to see. It’s got to be horrifying for children. Children are literally scared into believing. It’s obscene!
I’ll one up you and say that, as this post illustrates, in my dictionary, the number two definition of “worship” is “socially sanctioned child abuse.”
Fritzy, exactly! If people were displaying dead bodies, telling kids they are drinking the blood of their great Aunt Mavis or Uncle Louie, etc. the parents would be charged with emotional children abuse! I can’t understand why Xians think that Passion of the Crust is a good thing when they forbid their kids to see even Terminator movies, etc. My fundie niece won’t even allow her kids to see 2001 A Space Odyssey because of the monkey scene. Their church pastors told them it was on the “evil” list. But it’s okay to view blood and guts and torture because Passion is a movie about their religion.
17 February 2009, on 8:28 pm
Just a coupla lines to thank those who injected some humor into this.
I get so passionate about my non-belief I sometimes lose sight of the possibility of humor.
I gotta work on that…
17 February 2009, on 9:10 pm
The funny thing is, it was symbolic in the bible, too. The crazy Catholic mystical literalism came later. I guess I never had a problem with the ceremony in the weak tea Presbyterian church of my youth because 1) our pastor explained the symbolism, quoting the relevant passages pertaining to communion and 2) we didn’t take communion all that often, and later churches I attended that did it every Sunday I found a tad annoying, like they were overdoing it, or something. Of course, I also wanted to sneak a drink from the wine part of the tray, but I was a good kid, so I just slurped my grape fruit juice like I was supposed to.
Also, with a science teacher for a dad (who, I definitely noticed, only came to church on major holidays like Christmas and Easter), I definitely thought the “water into wine” miracle was bullshit, and ditto the walk-on-water shtick, and the “virgin birth”; I also had grave doubts (no pun intended) about the whole resurrection stuff from the get-go.
My church was surprisingly liberal/moderate, but I still rebelled because I became aware of f*cktards like Pat Robertson at an early age (Later when an anti-abortion petition got passed around in my High School freshman physics class, of all places, I pointedly refused to sign it, which surprised the heck out of my classmates). I knew how down they were on any kind of sex before marriage, and as a horny teen I knew damn well I didn’t want to wait to get married to experience sex. Fuck THEM! was my basic attitude back then. Still is today.
18 February 2009, on 5:11 pm
My church was surprisingly liberal/moderate,
So, JJR, you weren’t a “True Christian™ ” ?
21 February 2009, on 12:05 pm
I watched The Terminator with my nephew when he was in the single digits. He seemed to enjoy it, but did cry at the end.
If she’s a fundie, she probably would object to it allying with evolution rather than a rather tame scene with the monkey beating something to death. Plus, that’s the only entertaining scene in the whole movie and her kids can thank her later for not subjecting them to two hours (though it seems a lot longer) of total boringness.
It would be nice to experience it, but c’est la vie.